I am a Sanders supporter, so…
- I don’t support gay people.
I don’t support people of color.
I don’t support women.
I am purist/wild-eyed zealot.
I hate Hillary Clinton as a person.
I adopt Republican criticism of Clinton uncritically.
I am ignorant of Bernie’s flaws as a candidate.
I love Trump.
I want Trump to win.
None of the above is true. But I thought I’d lay out all the myths surrounding my support for Sanders and dismiss them in one blanket dismissal.
I’m a Hillary Supporter, so,
I am a moderate.
I am a conservative.
I love Wall Street.
I hate the white working class.
I hate white men.
I hate millenials.
I love corporations.
I am a corporate whore.
I am a Democratic whore.
I love big business.
I hate manufacturing jobs.
I love Republicans.
All also not true. This is a two way street, BernieBros. If you don’t like untrue aspersions cast upon you, perhaps you best not live in a glass house.
Aspersions.
That’s exactly what a Democratic whore would say. 😉
And it is long past time you all grew up and accept reality instead of having your multipost temper tantrum today.
Accept it:
Bernard Sanders will not be the Democratic nominee in 2016.
He will not be President.
He has lost the nomination to Hillary Clinton.
So it is long past time you all stop working to destroy Hillary and instead focus your guns on Trump.
Does Hillary have a weakness? Maybe. I tend to think it is not as severe as you, but regardless. Now is not the time to weaken her further. Now is the time to shore up weaknesses. Your refusal to do so is a betrayal and it makes you a Bernie or Buster.
Glad that’s all been ironed out. When do we get to talk about how Clinton isnt blowing out Trump in any polls, and how that should concern us all?…. especially those who enjoy drawing breath.
Is anyone really ok with a narrow win? Would that help the chances at the senate? Is it more fun just to insult each other? jerks.
Thank you anonymous.
Ben, CNN/ORC is 54-41. I guess you ignore that.
How does criticizing Hillary weaken her? Do you think leftists are making the same critique conservatives are?
Remember when we pointed out to Republicans that 10% of the opponents of Obamacare wanted it to go further, and that it didn’t mean we were with them in overall opposition? Same thing here.
Questing her is weakening her?
Any candidate who is “weakened” by vetting is too weak to have run in the first place.
Dems will win the Senate. You know, all you Bernie Supporters control the answers to all these questions. If you vote D, there is no problem. Hillary wins. Dems win the Senate and maybe even the House. If you don’t, and instead keeping talking about Bernie and how much you hate that bitch Hillary, then Hillary will lose, Dems will lose the Senate and House.
You control your fate.
This is how it will play out. Clinton supporters and the Party will be attacking Trump. Bernie supporters will hold Clinton’s feet to the fire making sure she does the left thing.
Ah, Ben thinks Hillary has never been vetted, just like Trump said today. If you really think that, you are a stone cold idiot.
I see what Delaware Dem did there. If Hillary wins, everything is fine. If Hillary loses, it is the fault of Bernie supporters.
DD, that is not enough of a margin for me. Not even close.
We (im saying we… which includes me, not necessarily you…. but maybe you…. these new rules about perfect comment structure are difficult, I may have to go back to making 99% of my comment disclaimer and explanation to avoid any future fights. …anyway, back to the comment……..) were all wrong about Trump. A lot of folks (here and other places… which is to say, here… as well as places both on and off line…. not to call anyone out specifically, but also not to NOT call anyone out) have failed to admit that, but it is a scary fact. If at any time, Clinton is not more that 15 points ahead of New Hitler, I see it as a problem.
Further, I have TRIED to accept Clinton as the nominee… Ignoring her blood thirsty supporters helps quite a bit. But my principles wont change no matter how scared I get. btw, why do you people want to curb-stomp Sanders’ supporters so bad? shouldn’t you be making sure we vote for your candidate?
“If you don’t, and instead keeping talking about Bernie and how much you hate that bitch Hillary, then Hillary will lose, Dems will lose the Senate and House.”
That’s rank conjecture. Once again, you are claiming that what we say has some indirect effect on what other people — not us, we’ve all said we’ll vote for Hillary — will do. How do you justify this conclusion given the lack of evidence for it?
Beyond that, nobody has called her a bitch. We have mostly stuck to issues, though of course whether to trust the staying power of her more populist positions does drift into the personality area. Still, from her past positions it’s hard to make the case that she is progressive rather than center-left.
First of all, DD. Dont call her a B***h…. or if you must, ** it out.
that’s horribly sexist and something only Trump supporters would do.
Second, Answer the question. Why is being demanding of a candidate weakening to them? I am demanding she differentiate herself from Democrats like Mike Castle or Republicans like Tom Carper. (yes, i know).
Maybe “vetting” wasn’t the right word……alright? I already got a lesson in making sure I read my comment as if someone who dislikes me will use it to distract from the point I was making, not in the mood for another..
Can we seriously move past the game of picking through every word to see if something can be interpreted in a way that allows us to attack? I meant being demanding of. I know she’s been vetted, dont call me an idiot.
” we’ve all said we’ll vote for Hillary ” Exactly.
In order to continue this fight, some folks have to pretend a lot of things weren’t already said. But I’ll be voting for the person most likely to defeat Trump. That will probably be Clinton…. in the mean time, I want her to commit more fervently to progressive economic goals. If she fights for them and comes up short, at least she tried. If she starts “compromising” with the Republicans from the Center…. we all know what’s going to happen.
Once again, can we let reality into the discussion?
Unless some of the commenters live outside Delaware, their votes will do nothing either way to Clinton’s electoral prospects. Delaware is solidly Blue. Unless some of those voters opt for Colin Bonini, they will elect a Democratic governor (not a liberal one, but a Democrat) and a Democrat as congressional Representative (looking more and more like Townsend).
What exactly do the “BernieBros” at DL bear responsibility for?
and to build on that…. who do you see as the BernieBros here? Is it that one dude who has been gone for weeks? Is it Sanders voters who have bent the knee to you, yet still resolved to make Clinton be more progressive? Why do you keep using a term that excludes the women who have supported Sanders? You throw that around alot, but what’s behind it?
I anxiously await Team Hillary to court us Bernie supporters and give us a reason to lift a finger for her.
I mean AFTER you tell me Trump Sucks. Which we all know. Let the pragmatic-progressive-believe-me-now-but-not-what-I-said-before revolution begin!
This controversy is kinda weird. Why is it happening? Why is it happening here? The only explanation or equivalency I can find in the modern world is in here….
Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince
“The only explanation or equivalency I can find in the modern world is in here….”
Game of Thrones
Just remember Winter Is Coming and Trump is the Night’s King.
and Ramsay.
From what I’ve read, Hillary has the highest negatives of any Democratic presumptive nominee since polling for that information has occurred. It’s sheer lunacy to suggest that fact results entirely or mostly from Bernie and his supporters and has absolutely nothing to do with her. It’s also laughably irresponsible of Hillary supporters to absolutely take no responsibility for supporting her knowing about her high negatives and to now (that it’s emerging she is potentially defeatable by a scumbag like Trump) wash their hands of any accountability for their choice and stupidly ignoring the one Democratic candidate who still outpolls Trump by a significant margin: Bernie Sanders.
Perhaps the most hilarious outcome of what’s emerging is that one of the initial arguments for preferring Hillary over Bernie was her gratuitously assumed greater likelihood of electability. What a joke that has been. And as ever honest observer knows: it always was a joke. It had nothing to do with electability. It was all about the establishment Dems rubber stamping Hillary and the cronies falling in line.
I may have missed it, but your tone to Hillary was very not nice. I’m wagging my finger at it.
“Does Hillary have a weakness? Maybe. I tend to think it is not as severe as you, but regardless. Now is not the time to weaken her further. Now is the time to shore up weaknesses. Your refusal to do so is a betrayal and it makes you a Bernie or Buster.”
whoa, whoa, whoa there Smokey. Does Hillary maybe have a weakness? Did you just acquiesce there? Now isn’t the time to weaken her further is right. She’s borderline undetectable with her appeal to voters that have a freaking clue as to what she is really about.
If now is the time to shore up her weaknesses it’s a little too freaking late for that isn’t it? I mean she’s had a few freaking decades to do it already. No? She had 8 years to shore up her weaknesses. All she shored up was a her freaking personal war room ripe with a few dozen Dell Servers. A few speaking engagements to Goldman Sachs (remember them? Caused a financial meltdown and paid no price? Have a CEO that compared himself to God)
Why must people grow up exactly? What is that requires some maturing on my part? You’ve used words like this before (petulant another) to describe non Hillary supporters.
You tell me what she is going to do that is going to be so great for this country? Please because I don’t know. And her not being trump is hardly a reason to elect her flip flopping I was being fired upon in a helicopter ass
Hillary is clearly Doran Martell. NOT SHOW DORAN. Got that? The show absolutely assassinated that character (in every sense of the word) But book Doran… I swear, that show can make me angrier than anything DD says. Maybe because I like fiction more than reality…… ANYHOO.
Doran Martell (while male, so not exactly like him) plays the long game. He is constantly accused by his own house for being too compromising, too appeasing, and weak. In reality, he has a master plan to take down the GoP… er, um.. Lannisters… that requires him to appear to play along with the enemy. Bernie is the High Sparrow, Elizabeth Warren is Ayra.
“Perhaps”Hillary has a weakness? That’s seriously in doubt? That’s a joke, right?
Here’s what I’ve noticed. Every time Hillary agrees with something Bernie says (see debates) she’s been accused of pandering. For people wanting her to move left, you (general you) don’t really allow her to do that.
I personally am a Hillary supporter because I want her daughters husband hedge fund business to sky rocket. I like how Hillary and Bill are a family first, America Second couple. They speak to my generation and everything this country is now about. Individualism.
“Here’s what I’ve noticed. Every time Hillary agrees with something Bernie says (see debates) she’s been accused of pandering. For people wanting her to move left, you (general you) don’t really allow her to do that.”
You get accused of that when you are unauthentic and people don’t like you…as well as when your record tends to prove you’re a person that votes with the wind and you don’t really have a conscious. Aka Mike Castle
Okay, so she shouldn’t move to the left because she’d be called unauthentic, and why bother since people don’t like her. Got it.
Is there a bigger fallacy than a candidate “moving”, “pivoting”, “hedging” in a direction come election time? I mean can we stop with the nonsense. Like DelDem would say, be a grown up and accept reality. Clinton like her current President isn’t going to move left and stay there. She’s going to move left, waive to you, let you take her picture, then believe she moved left, then move right the eff back where she was the entire time and her entire career.
I mean really, how silly this all is
If “Bernie is the High Sparrow” I’m pretty sure you would want Clinton to be Cersei and have her dealt with by Bernie in a similar manner as the High Sparrow did.
The question is who will save us from the White Walkers and the Nights King? It is either the true King in the North or Daenerys the last Targaryen (except for Jon Snow is probably also a Targaryen).
The High Sparrow can’t lift a sword and this is going to be a battle and we honestly need someone who is resolute. While I may not like Clinton, she is able do battle. She may lose, but not without a fight.
There are great many folk who will survive Trump with no discomfort at all. But as in any war, the ones who suffer are those who already have nothing but will lose everything they do have in a Trump administration.
It really boils down to how one sees the wealthy should be treated.
Should the wealthy be made to pay back some of the debt we incurred by giving them tax breaks in 2003? Support Bernie.
Should the wealthy be given a pass, allowed to keep their past excesses, and only pay a small pittance going forward ? Then you need to get behind Hillary.
Other than that, (unless you are a Palestinian in Gaza and even then not much) there is very little difference between the two.
Sure, so if not Bernie, then anybody. Ok.
^
???
The way you described Clinton wasnt much different than what Trump is, so what the heck does it matter?
Oh, all or you, grow up and live in the real world.
Furrfu.
@k “Should the wealthy be made to pay back some of the debt we incurred by giving them tax breaks in 2003? Support Bernie.”
I agree with the premise, yet strongly support Hillary. I find Bernie nettlesome and bungling, and at this point, FAR more likely to do harm than to do anything useful.
Maybe it doesn’t really boil down the way you think it should…
To all SANDERS supporters : You do NOT have to vote for Hillary . Not a problem . We will win without you .
“To all SANDERS supporters : You do NOT have to vote for Hillary . Not a problem . We will win without you .”
But this mentality is a PROBLEM.
It’s also complete BS. Obama needed Clinton voters, Clinton needs Sanders voters. Not all of em, but most.
In 2008 Obama didn’t need to make policy concessions to win over Clinton voters because their policies were so similar, unlike Sanders vs. Clinton.
With Trump as the nominee, the policy debate is going to be
“should we round up and murder all the Muslims or not” or
“lets force anyone who looks Latino, to carry paperwork” or
“Women…. punish them or not?” I couldnt give less of a a crap about money in politics when those are the topics on the table.
I don’t think Trump’s “OMG he said what??” comments from the primary are going to be his main campaign points in the general, as much as Hillary wants them to be.
DD, you’ve been honest about the fact that you think the party establishment is the best way to improve the country. That is a completely valid belief and I believe will have its test in the coming years, since it’s pretty clear that Clinton will be the next president.
Other democrats don’t think that way. They try to pick the candidate that best suits what they want for the country, vote for that, and criticize any candidate that doesn’t represent their ideal. THIS IS ALSO A VALID VIEWPOINT. They want to know how the deficiencies that they see will present in a presidency, or if they’ve fucked up in the past, how that will be avoided in the presidency. They know that this doesn’t end on Election Day, and will continue to question throughout the presidency. This doesn’t weaken a candidate, it arguably makes them stronger, and you should stop trying to silence the voters that show that kind of passion. Suggesting that criticizing even an established frontrunner is “an attempt to destroy” them is absurd.
You bickering Dems need to take a moment, chill, and remember that when Election Day comes around, you’re all going to be voting for the same person, no matter what bilious invective you scream at each other in the meantime. Stop being dicks.
So he does what, puck? Say he was lying just to win the GOP nomination? Say he won’t deport Hispanics? He will let Muslims in the country? He won’t punish women who have an abortion? He wasn’t serious about the wall? How much can he walk back and not only keep his base but win over conservatives who never trusted him to begin with? Why was this the biggest hurdle facing McCain and Romney, but it isn’t considered one with Trump?
He has a problem with Cruz supporters – who didn’t get much coverage, but should have. They are extremely conservative. I have family (so embarrassing) who are Cruz supporters and they will not vote for Trump because of religious and “moral” reasons – they are the Christian Right and they still exist. Sure some will end up voting for Trump, but not all. Even less if he suddenly goes all “liberal” which they’ve always suspected he is.
I also have a lot of Republican friends (wealthy, not conservative) who will not vote for Trump. No way, no how. So if we want to discuss voter turn-out then let’s discuss all voter turn-out. Hillary wins easily if Dems are united. It’s in our hands. We’ll decide if Trump becomes President and the fate of the SCOTUS.
Bernie success is mostly attributed to a general distrust of Hillary. She deserves to be beaten by Biden and then thrown into Gitmo.
PS. Of course a big percentage of Bernie’s supporters want something for nothing too.
“PS. Of course a big percentage of Bernie’s supporters want something for nothing too.” Whatever helps you sleep at night Tom.
Bullshit – When it comes down to it these folks for vote R. To much at stake voting in another D. Look around Delaware they destroy everything they govern. How about Wilmington????
I also have a lot of Republican friends (wealthy, not conservative) who will not vote for Trump. No way, no how. So if we want to discuss voter turn-out then let’s discuss all voter turn-out. Hillary wins easily if Dems are united. It’s in our hands. We’ll decide if Trump becomes President and the fate of the SCOTUS.
I sleep very well knowing that I earned what I have.
I bet knowing that others are starving to death, while working 50 hours a week also helps you sleep.
I guess it really depends on how you define what should be earned and what should be given.
Access to healthcare? Something you should have to earn?
Access to modern infrastructure?
Access to quality education?
Access to food?
Access to clean water?
Access to a viable job market?
Do we earn those things? Should we?
“I find Bernie nettlesome and bungling, and at this point, FAR more likely to do harm than to do anything useful.”
Me too, but it’s the hand Clinton has been dealt and she will have to play it. She seems to be completely turned to the general, which I believe is the appropriate response.
Many families have that little brother, who wants to sit at the adults table, or play tackle football with their big brother and his friends. What they do in most families is to find something to distract him (look there’s a squirrel!). It usually only works for a little bit and then they are back to pestering, but you love the little guy and so you just have to put up with it.
It’s the hand she dealt herself. Hillary Clinton’s reputation and the fact that so many dislike her is the result of Hillary Clinton’s choices throughout her career. She’s been attacked? So what? What politician isn’t?
Many families have a condescending asshole big brother, and we piss in his coffee when he isn’t looking.
Thanks to Bernie’s continued efforts and that of crazy Trump, the issues discussed will involve Jobs, trade deals, income and power inequality and outsourcing jobs and these will be discussed way more than Clinton would be discussing them I suspect..
“Many families have that little brother, who wants to sit at the adults table, or play tackle football with their big brother and his friends. What they do in most families is to find something to distract him (look there’s a squirrel!). It usually only works for a little bit and then they are back to pestering, but you love the little guy and so you just have to put up with it.”
You’d be right if polls didn’t show the largest voting block in the country is neither Democrat or Republican.
It’s more like we’re the younger brother who’s tired of Grandpa going off the rails on “What’s wrong with this country” and blaming us lazy do-nothing expect-everything kids and if we kept things the way they were we’d be just fine; so we stop coming to the dinner table.
Under Hillary the economy of the last 35 years continues