C’mon
“Pastor” Jones is only a symptom of the real problem.
Speaking just now on MSNBC James Zogby made a very good point — and pressed Andrea Mitchell on it. His point was that sure, this Pastor Jones fool is one guy, who’s managed to get worldwide attention for his stunt. But you cannot separate him, as I noted below, from the whole climate of hate speech and anti-Muslim agitation from the Newt Gingriches and the Sarah Palins and the rest of them.
At that point, Mitchell jumped in and said, wait, Palin said she disagrees with the Koran burning. To which Zogby replied, something to the effect of ‘C’mon’. And that’s just the right reply.
The lone wolves are part of a bigger pack.
And here’s more evidence from the No Sh*t department. (Via The Plum Line)
We now have clear evidence that there’s a direct link between public anti-Islam sentiment and public opposition to the construction of Cordoba House, a.k.a. the “Ground Zero mosque.”
The evidence can be found in the internals of the new Washington Post poll on Islam and the planned center, and it was provided to me by Post polling director Jon Cohen. The numbers directly contradict the claim by opponents that public opposition to the project is not linked to broader anti-Islam sentiment, and is only rooted in a desire to be sensitive to 9/11 families or to respect Ground Zero as hallowed ground.
The poll’s toplines show that 66 percent of Americans oppose the Islamic center. Separately, a plurality, 49 percent, has generally unfavorable views of Islam.
But it’s the intersection of these numbers revealed in the internals that proves the point.
Here’s the rub: According to the internals sent my way, opposition to the “Ground Zero mosque” is overwhelmingly driven by those with an unfavorable view of Islam:
Tags: Religious Fanatics, Republicans
Terry Jones was run out of Germany in 2009. He ran a church in Cologne, was accused of taking church money, and his radical views were so appalling, the church threw him out. He stated “he and his wife were appointed by God” and demanded his congregation follow him otherwise they would be working against God. Derspiegel reporting.
Only a matter of time before someone cited a credible, objective source like Zogby who takes the huge leap to attempt to tie the acts of that attention-whoring, hypocritical, small-minded asshole in Florida, to Palin, etc.
You mean the same James Zogby who is:
– The author of Arab Voices
– Founder and president of the Arab American Institute
– Member of the Executive Committee of the Democratic National Committee.
– Former Deputy Campaign manager and Senior Advisor to the Jesse Jackson
Presidential campaign.
– On the national advisory boards of the American Civil Liberties Union and
Democrats for Life of America
– Delegate to the 2008 Democratic National Convention.
“The poll’s toplines show that 66 percent of Americans oppose the Islamic center. Separately, a plurality, 49 percent, has generally unfavorable views of Islam.”
Well, no shit. It’s astounding that most people associate radical Muslim terrorists, who commit their atrocities in the name of Islam, with Islam. What a revelation.
“C’mon”, indeed.
But even those with an unfavorable view of Islam may still disagree with the Qur’an burning. The support numbers may be higher in that group, but lumping them together in a general grouping is irresponsible.
In my Force and World Politics class today we discussed this very issue. Two or three of my fellow students described how they were against the Mosque but they were also against the Qur’an burning. The same three also stated that they recognized the Muslims’ right to build and the pastor’s right to burn. I would suggest that of the 66% who are opposed to the Mosque, the majority is also against the Qur’an burning. It is recognized that the 1st amendment protects the imam and the pastor.
Well, no shit. It’s astounding that most people associate radical Muslim terrorists, who commit their atrocities in the name of Islam, with Islam.
Collective guilt is great! Why don’t we associate all Christians with Christian anti-abortion terrorists then? Or the IRA?
Collective guilt is great! Why don’t we associate all Christians with Christian anti-abortion terrorists then? Or the IRA?
This was a point I raised during a debate in another one of my classes. I asked should Christians be allowed to build a church next to the site of an abortion clinic blown up “in the name of Christ”? The answer, obviously, is yes because the vast majority of Christians aren’t nuts like the fringe of the religion. Same is said about Muslims. There have been many condemnations of terrorism by Muslim scholars, imams, etc.
Miscreant,
Why do you think 9/11 was any more “committed in the name of Islam”, than My Lai was committed in the name of Christianity?
I don’t why people think something written in the 7th century explains present day realities.
The Dove Church took down its website Thrusday. Gee they must have had a large number of hits. Betting this nut backs down. Can you imagine the conversation between the snake worshiper and the FBI?
Yes a vast majority of “christians are nuts like this guy”, because the take the Bible literally. Sorry, if you look at the list of Muslim countries the US has invaded over the years, is there any wonder muslims are fearful, especially american muslims? How bout soldiers in Georgia being mass baptized before being sent to Afganistan? Sounds like Christian crusades all over again to me.
Apparently, the website was taken down by the web host for violations of the “hate speech” terms of its service agreement.
He Blinked! Cancelled the bonfire of insanity!
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/news/2010/09/fla_minister_cancels_burning_of_qurans_on_911.php?ref=fpa
“But even those with an unfavorable view of Islam may still disagree with the Qur’an burning.”
Yes, like yours truly. I think it is hateful, and a misguided attempt at this miscreant’s (heh) 15 minutes of fame. He knows innocent people (probably Christians, ironically) will likely die because of his vain publicity stunt. Because of the attention he is getting, whether we like it or not, in the world view, he represents America and Christianity. However, it’s his constitutional right to express himself, no matter how perverted and disgusting. However, as is pointed out here often, free speech can have serious repercussions, and I hope he feels the brutal sting. I mean that in the nicest possible way.
“The Dove Church took down its website Thrusday.”
They have a lively Facebook site. If you can stomach friending these assholes, you can get a few comments in there.
“Why do you think 9/11 was any more “committed in the name of Islam”, than My Lai was committed in the name of Christianity?”
That may qualify as one of the stupidest analogies I’ve ever seen (even for Delaware Liberal). Those are your projections, not mine.
“I don’t why people think something written in the 7th century explains present day realities.”
Same here. Perhaps
“But even those with an unfavorable view of Islam may still disagree with the Qur’an burning.”
Yes, like yours truly. I think it is hateful, and a misguided attempt at this miscreant’s (heh) 15 minutes of fame. He knows innocent people (probably Christians, ironically) will likely die because of his vain publicity stunt. Because of the attention he is getting, whether we like it or not, in the world view, he represents America and Christianity. However, it’s his constitutional right to express himself, no matter how perverted and disgusting. However, as is pointed out here often, free speech can have serious repercussions, and I hope he feels the brutal sting. I mean that in the nicest possible way.
“The Dove Church took down its website Thrusday.”
They have a lively Facebook site. If you can stomach friending these assholes, you can get a few comments in there.
“Why do you think 9/11 was any more “committed in the name of Islam”, than My Lai was committed in the name of Christianity?”
That may qualify as one of the stupidest analogies I’ve ever seen (even for Delaware Liberal). Those are your projections, not mine.
“I don’t why people think something written in the 7th century explains present day realities.”
Same here. Perhaps you should ask a Muslim, or Reverend Jones.
The Newark UU church (www.uufn.org) is hosting a time to stand together for religious tolerance, this Saturday. The following is from the pastor Rev. Greg Chute
“You may have seen that Rev Jones is at it again and plans to burn the Koran in a gathering of his minions in Florida on Saturday. I have rec’d several e-mails from progressive groups across the country who plan to meet and read from the Koran and stand in solidarity with our Muslim brothers & sisters.
So I invite you to join me at UUFN at noon to support religious freedom and respect. It will also be a moment to remember the tragic events of 9/11/01.
Blessings – Greg”
The bigger problem is the “moderate” Muslims who insist that we not speak or act in a way that offends them lest their “extremist” brethren engage in more terrorism.
Sounds like the local bag man showing up and telling the businessman who doesn’t want to pay the mob’s “assessment” that it would be just awful if a fire were to break out in the middle of the night, or if one of his kids had a terrible accident.
Let me guess — the UU church is going to be tolerant of everyone who acts in conformity with UU principles, and intolerant of those who don’t. Doesn’t sound very tolerant to me, what with that church doing nothing more than exercising First Amendment rights like good Americans.
Matt wrote:
But not Imam Rauf, who explicitly refused to call Hamas a terrorist organization.
Most of the Palestinians are not terrorists, in that they aren’t the ones organizing the bombing attacks against Israel, and most of the German civilians in World War II weren’t in the Wehrmacht. But the larger Palestinian population amongst which the Hamas guerrillas live and hide and prepare their attacks are enabling Hamas to continue their campaign against Israel, just like the German civilians who were working in the factories and even just growing food were enabling the Wehrmacht to stay in the field fighting, and even the Schutzstaffel to run the concentration camps,
My question to you is one that a large number of Americans worry about, even if they haven’t quite put it into words: does the larger Islamic community enable the Islamists to continue to fight?
We hear about people like Imam Rauf saying that the United States already supports Shari’a law, because he describes Shari’a in oh-so-moderate terms, terms of basically respecting your neighbor. Then we turn around and see Shari’a in action: an Islamic couple stoned to death because she chose to marry a man she wanted to marry rather than the husband assigned to her, or two teenaged boys hung in Iran for homosexual activity. Yet we don’t seem to hear the supposedly moderate Muslims condemning such things, we don’t seem to hear them trying to excise the extremists; where are the condemnations from the moderate Muslims akin to the way Christians trash idiots like Fred Phelps?
Dana,
“does the larger Islamic community enable the Islamists to continue to fight?”
You have a problem with “Islamists who continue to fight.”
Let me spell it out for you.
It’s only natural for people who are attacked and invaded, be they Palestinian, Iraqi …or Apache, to fight.