What does this mean?

“Hospitals and insurance companies work hand in hand”.

Only where they have the same ownership (please see my previous posts). Otherwise, it’s not in the hospitals’ interests to do that; the two parties negotiate every 2-3 years over every inpatient day, every procedure, every ancillary, etc. That’s hardly hand-in-hand, unless by that you mean “combat.” But, when the patient runs out of insurance money, the hospital will look to dump elsewhere him as quickly as legally possible. Because not for profit doesn’t mean “we don’t want to charge you.”

“How many millions does Christiana Care have in the bank profit wise?”

I don’t know; I don’t live in Delaware. And everything in the bank isn’t “profit.” Take an accounting lesson: what’s in the bank must include IBNR, the required state reserve, funds for capital improvement (unless you don’t want real technology in your hospital next year), etc.

“Yet they push folk out the door constantly who have medicare and other insurance and force employees to do double work.”

Ah, now we get to your real point: you’ve had a personal experience that you’re pissed about. Point taken. Everyone has. But that doesn’t have anything to do with my discussion.

Do you have data to prove “double work.” or “push folk out the door constantly”? Constantly is pretty damned hard to prove, friend.

Just because there’s no not for profit insurer in your area, doesn’t mean there aren’t any. The major carrier in my area (75% of the market) is not for profit. Go over the border to Pa and you’ll find several NFPs. As Cassandra said, teh Google is your friend.

And every hospital in NY state is not for profit. And not one of them is owned by an insurance carrier.

So what’s your problem, specifically with my “facts?” I got that you don’t like Carper — he isn’t particularly beloved around these boards, either — but what the hell’s your problem with me?

Blue Cross Blue Shield started out non profit, but soon found out how much they could steal by going for profit. Hospitals are throwing patients out before they are ready to make a profit for the insurance companies. Hospitals and insurance companies work hand in hand. How many millions does Christiana Care have in the bank profit wise? Yet they push folk out the door constantly who have medicare and other insurance and force employees to do double work.

Kaiser is an old whore (and yes I am using that word). I have navigated organ transplant surgery thru that system, and was HORRIFIED at the bureacratic web one has to detangle, and the warehousing of CRITICAL patients they keep warehoused in local hospitals awaiting to be “called up”. I have NEVER seen that back East here–our critical patients are kept in house at our larger university hospital etc., and continually monitored and managed preparing for a hopeful transplant. My sense was KP just kept them hospitalized in a KP facility, no interventions etc., in hopes of…I’m not going to say. I literally had to dictate orders on a 35 yo pt. awaiting a liver/kidney transplant to a hepatologist–whose current orders read like the person was in a nursing home w/ routine needs. My on-site visit to this local hospital was the kick in the #@* for transfer to UCSF…and the story goes on from there.

The only non-profit I know w/ any heart in the matter, who manages financially well, and gives excellent distribution of care, up to and including, sending out a patient from their system when needed is Intermountain Health Care (IHC).

I hope Mayo does well and wish them well–Scripps too–but the thing w/ lending your name to these “ventures” in healthcare, really can diminish one’s credibility ( Penn’s gone through it, and Hopkins has scrambled too) These hospitals really need to re-evaluate the whole insurance alignment thing, because it is coming back to bite ‘em.

As for DL and Carper — come by more often and continue reading!

It is carpetbagger Carper who is destroying the public option. He is bringing his “exchanges”, and Opt in/Opt out” garbage to Reid behind closed doors with Lincoln, Leiberman, Nelson and Landrieu.

It will be Delaware who will be credited with loosing the Public Option, because it is Tom Carper who continues to fight against the citizens and on behalf of the insurance companies. How fast can you spell traitor, treasonist, prostitute? Even Howard Dean had the courage to call Carper out. He is a “silly man”, and an obstructionist. I thought all you libs supported Howard Dean. Is it because you don’t want to lash out at the person responsible for the Public Option destruction because he is a demorat? What hypocrisy.

Canada’s system and the U.K.’s system is like that as well. Many companies offer supplemental insurance. Even Medicare has supplements. It’s a system that works.

You are describing the Swiss system, so yours is no pipe dream.

“And for those who argue that there should not be for-profit insurance companies, consider that people have to eat. Why should we let farmers, food processors, grocers and restaurants make any profit at all? Is it more important that they be allowed to profit or that people be allowed to eat?”

To pick just one of a score of differences, because those in the food stream produce something. Those in health insurance produce nothing.

There, I’ve started you off. You should be able to compile another 19 differences by lunchtime.