Steve Newton gives the Delaware Blogosphere a spanking
If you haven’t read Steve’s post over at Delaware Libertarian you should. And even though it’s obvious he doesn’t have a horse in this race he makes some valid points. Now allow me to add a few of my own.
Has this election season become overly divisive? Yes. I won’t argue with that point, instead I’ll try and analyze what makes this year more impassioned than 2000 and 2004.
We can start with Obama, but we’re not going to end there. And that’s problem number one. Despite all the labeling (empty suit, the “One”, Messiah) most Obama supporters can see past their candidate to the issues. The fact we receive absolutely no credit for understanding the issues and are constantly accused of hero worship and kool-aid drinking is a major source of conflict. These terms, which have been used since day one, are insulting and pretty much shut down the possibility of civil debate. Which I’m beginning to think is the point of these attacks.
Moving past Obama we arrive at the heart of the matter: The last eight years. And make no mistake this election is about the last eight years. It’s also about the Democrats’ role in making two Bush terms possible. Did you catch that last line? We helped put Bush in office. Twice. And if you agree with my assertion then you might understand the rigid stance Dems have embarked on this year. If not, let me explain…
In 2000, when Bush ran against Gore the electorate was pretty disinterested. Nader’s platform of there’s no difference between the candidates resonated. And to my ever lasting shame I was one of those people who joked about “Gush and Bore”. Boy, am I sorry now. Little did I (or anyone, I suspect) foresee how destructive the Bush Presidency would be. I actually believed he was against Nation Building! So when 2004 rolled around we were ready to win. Were we not? Didn’t we rise up and defend Kerry against those vile swift boat ads? Umm… no. Didn’t we organize and do everything in our power to change an Electoral College map that was stacked against us? Nope. Did we allow any disagreement with Bush and Co. to be used to question our patriotism? You betcha.
What’s missing this election, and what many are lamenting, is the loss of the predictable liberal debate. You know, the sort of dialogue where liberals are objective, quickly pointing out their candidate’s imperfections while justifying their support. This trait is one of the reasons Republicans love liberals. Normally, we’re quite happy to show the other side where to aim the knife.
So what happened this year? Obama? To some extent, but not all. This movement is much bigger than one man. It’s almost as if the Dems woke up one day and realized an election is about winning; that winning is step one, and without step one there is no step two. In essence, we’ve taken a page out of the Republican playbook. We not only fell in love, we fell in line. And we’re staying in both of these states until election day. Political purity be damned. We’ve played that game before – a game, I might point out, that Republicans haven’t participated in until this year.
Granted, McCain is a lousy candidate. He use to be the Republican only a Democrat could love. Now nobody loves him. Which might explain why our trolls constantly (and I do mean constantly) go after Obama. Could it be they attack Obama because they have nothing good to say about McCain?
It’s going to be a long two weeks. My advice would be to buckle in for a bumpy ride. Liberals, being liberals, will return to standard form soon enough and the Delaware blogosphere will survive… once everyone ventures out from their respective corners.
Tags: 2008 Presidential, Blogosphere, Delaware
Good post pandora.
The Ralph Nader thing positively made me see red in 2000 and I still foam at the mouth everytime I hear it. The last eight years prove just how wrong he was. The differences between the Republicans and the Democrats are vast!!!!!
Our world views are different. Our sense of fairness is different. Heck, even those of us who go to church have diametrically opposed views of religion. There is simply no comparison of us versus them.
And, as you say, we have finally chosen up sides and taken a stand. We’ll all be better off for it on November 5th. In the meantime, this is too important to extend the olive branch. We can be magnanimous when the grown-ups are in charge again.
Bad time for Donviti to be sleep deprived…
Seriously, I am not partial to racism debates of the kind that we have seen. I do not like BS posts about willful ignorance of Obama. I am averse to Bristol/Trig rumor-mongering.
New poll question: If the election were held today… wouldn’t that be great?
This is the best summary I’ve ever read of our current situation.
And this part…
What’s missing this election, and what many are lamenting, is the loss of the predictable liberal debate. You know, the sort of dialogue where liberals are objective, quickly pointing out their candidate’s imperfections while justifying their support. This trait is one of the reasons Republicans love liberals. Normally, we’re quite happy to show the other side where to aim the knife.
100% spot on!!
Count me in the underwhelmed column for Steve’s post.
You put a bunch of political junkies in one place with a bunch of history-making elections imminent and you get a bunch of political junkies obsessing about what political junkies obsess about. It is why alot of us are here and in other blogs.
I don’t get why you would take a bunch of political blogs to task for being partisan. All of these blogs had a POV before this election and they will still have a POV after the election. If you aren’t interested in the partisanship then don’t read or — or better yet — use your blog to figure out if there is a way to have the parties take the edge off.
What I do think is new this round Democrats rather uncowed by the usual calls for them to be kinder and gentler. And for good reason.
Like Jason, I think that this is exactly right:
What’s missing this election, and what many are lamenting, is the loss of the predictable liberal debate. You know, the sort of dialogue where liberals are objective, quickly pointing out their candidate’s imperfections while justifying their support. This trait is one of the reasons Republicans love liberals. Normally, we’re quite happy to show the other side where to aim the knife.
Exactly right. Add to that that Republicans are newly vulnerable so that even their transitional media supporters are moving away from them and you have an entire conversation that has changed its focus.
Great Post, Pandora.
“The fact we receive absolutely no credit”
Is this what bloging is about seeking credit? Dam, I just thought it was a soapbox to express oneself and to spark some debate. I’ll have to admit when Kilroy’s enter this insane world Hube rated Kilroy’s at C+ and I was tickled! C+ is passing! Big Al slapped me around a bit but when he realized I had heart he gave me some credit!
Poor Mike Matthews, the heart and soul of Delawaretalkradio.com get’s no respect. In fact he and I were in line at a local McDonald’s and he was in line before me. The counterpersons looked passed Mike and asked me for my order. Matthew’s spoke up, “what about me I was inline first.” The counterperson told Mike, “get the hell out you don’t deserve a break today.”
Seeking credit for blog post when school board members get no credit for their long dedication for serving children goes unnoticed is what I call, social injustice!
I think the difference is the Bush years. Even ideological purists know that it’s more important to beat the Republicans than their own single issue. The Reagan revolution is over and we’re moving into the new progressive era.
As far as constructive dialogue with Republicans – most of the people who are strong Republicans are still Bush supporters. I can’t have a logical conversation with them. Most of the moderates have either become independents or joined the Democratic party.
“most of the people who are strong Republicans are still Bush supporters.”
I haven’t found this to be the case at all, but maybe you and I are talking to different folks. Maybe I’m just not talking to die-hard Republicans?
Pandora – Your post is excellent. I agree. This election is historic, and with 8 years of Bush it was pretty much inevitable that it was going to be divisive.
As far as you folks “not getting any credit,” well there has been a ton of Obama worship going on during this election and folks on the other side are rightly going to point that out, especially given what Obama brings to the table when you look beneath that aura. (that said, Palin has brought out some of the same kind of worship among conservatives)
I think this election more than anything is, as you said, a reaction to the last 8 years. That’s how national politics works. It’s cyclical, and when you’ve got someone as unpoplar as Bush the whole country was bound to shift left, and the left was naturally going to be reactionary and shift even further left, which explains why we got Obama.
With Kerry & Gore the Dems tried the Moderate Dem. approach, especially as both tried to move to the center during the election. It didn’t work, so maybe nominating someone as far left as Obama is exactly what the party needed. We’ll find out soon enough.
Steve should have listened to the right wing neo con media hogs, Hannity and Rush. No two people have added such drivel, lies and distortions to the political equation than those two. Nothing said on any of these blogs even begin to compare with the “drive by media” found on Fox Fixed News.
Debate is essential to our democracy. Fear mongering and terrorizing the electorate based on lies and distortions must be taken to task.
Why haven’t the Steve’s of the world taken to task the “neo con” policies, the trickle down economics which brought this country to its knees.
We have every right to state our views whether liberal, progressive as that is what Delaware Liberal’s name means.
Moderates are just as furious with the neo cons as the rest of us. Both parties are too blame because neither party is working for the citizens, but working for corporate america. That is our challenge to expose both sides and good debate on the issues is necessary.
Why haven’t the Steve’s of the world taken to task the “neo con” policies, the trickle down economics which brought this country to its knees.
Obviously, you don’t read my blog or you’d know that I have.
Fear mongering and terrorizing the electorate based on lies and distortions must be taken to task.
Agreed. But that wasn’t what was going on with the “Sarah Palin didn’t really have a baby” story, or with “Dom, you are a racist piece of shit” or “all Republicans should be rounded up and shot.”
cassandra’s comment bothers me for exactly the same reason that GOP tactics have bothered me for years (and yes anon I have spoken about that: your failure to read it does not equate with my silence)–when you become your enemy, but only for the best of intentions, naturally, then you compromise your power before your administration ever starts.
If cassandra prefers to believe that John Kerry lost an election that was easily his to win because rank-and-file Dems were too passive, without considering the large number of inept tactical moves Kerry made as a candidate to keep Dubya in the game, that’s her problem.
And lets’s highlight why folks think that we are overly partisan:
If cassandra prefers to believe that John Kerry lost an election that was easily his to win because rank-and-file Dems were too passive, without considering the large number of inept tactical moves Kerry made as a candidate to keep Dubya in the game, that’s her problem.
Really? And how — exactly — do you get this entire Kerry narrative out of my post?
So now I get to point out that Steve’s argument is a strawman — largely designed to get the argument to something he wants to talk about, and I’m going to be the one that is overly partisan for not following him down that rabbit hole. And for having the nerve to point out that this was not part of my post.
For now, we only have your assertion that we have become our own enemy. I don’t know what that means, but I imagine that you don’t either. It just sounds sorta high-minded to take a partisan blog to task for being partisan.
“Overly divisive” Why, Pandora? By what standard? In many ways, this is literally a fight between life and death. Between ignorance and knowledge. Between bigotry and tolerance.
So divisive? Absolutely. Overly divisive? Hell, no! Choose your side.
I know many many Obama supporters, and not one thinks he is a savior or even agrees with more than 80% of his positions. No blogger here thinks he is a savior, either. Liberals are more than capable of having thoughtful disagreements and arguments about policies – that is healthy.
So Steve Newton is upset that Delaware Liberal has some strident liberal voices – well, too bad and boo hoo. Stick to the Freepers and Redstate, then. Or go hang out with the DLC.
The problem with this site is not the strident liberals, no, the problem is that it allows bobble-head repubs, racists, and ditto heads to fire bomb the threads with their unsupported and unsupportable garbage. How many racist and insulting posts does Mike the Racist have to make before he is banned forever? How many “the one” or repub talking point lie posts does somebody get to make before they are banned?
When are the DL publisher going to realize that they don’t have to be the targets of racism, ridicule, hate, and divisiveness caused by many of the garbage posters here?
The right wingnut posters aren’t here to have their minds changed; they’re here to sabotage this site, control the threads, and destroy the possibility of high-level of liberal conversation. I don’t understand why the DL publishers don’t get this or act on it, if they do get it. The rightwing has plenty of megaphones – why do you let them have this one, too?
Mike the Racist:
There is no such thing as “Obama Worship” except in the mind of right wing racists like yourself. You’re not wanted here. Go TF away.
Gotta agree with post #12. They are not here for conversation, they are here to destroy the site. Unfortunately, certain of the authors here (y’all know who you are) keep replying to them.
I’ve learned to skip the non-local posts. The local ones remain unpolluted, because these folks don’t seem to know or care about local politics.
I’m guilty as charged. I have ratcheted up the vitriol several notches recently. Here are my personal reasons:
1.) As mentioned in the post, there is historical reference here. The last eight years have made me very angry and I have decided to embrace it. Anyone at this point who is prepared to vote for another Republican with a kooky Christianist on the ticket needs to have their head examined.
2.) This isn’t really the forum for high-brow debate, is it? With all due respect this is a bunch of want-to-bes throwing out zingers and one-liners… and conservatives trolling around baiting each other. Myself included. I am sure many of us could have a great conversation over a few beers about politics, history, the economy, etc. But it isn’t going to happen here.
Just lower your expectations. Everyone voting for McCain/Palin already have.
I still believe that after the election “great conversation” will return. Well… maybe not great! 😉
Anonone,
WTF is your problem? Is it really necessary to essentially END THE DEBATE by calling Mike W. a racist? Get the hell over it.
Ahhh, Mike Mathews,
Mike the Racist has made some pretty despicable racist comments about Obama in past posts. His agenda is clear, even if you missed it.
And I won’t “get the hell over” bullshit posts against Obama by a racist gun nut. I guess that is my problem, since you asked.
Are you still trolling for him to be a guest on your show?
No, now I’m trolling for your dumb ass to come on my show!
Mike I’ll call today to talk about this BS. Is 4:30 okay?
430 is perfect. I’m having Steve Newton on tomorrow, so it should be an interesting week!
Mike M, you really know how to make a person feel special. 🙂
“Mike the Racist has made some pretty despicable racist comments about Obama in past posts. His agenda is clear, even if you missed it.”
Care to prove it? Baseless accusations as usual.
Again, please try to be zen about the baseless charges of racism. They are a simple defense mechanism that helps them cope with the uncomfortable fact that everyone is not, in fact, on the Obama train. They can’t help themselves. It’s like flinching when someone swings at you. Deep breaths. In through the nose…out through the mouth.