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	<title>Comments on: Serious Question</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/</link>
	<description>Ground zero for all things political in Delaware</description>
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		<title>By: mike w.</title>
		<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/#comment-42629</link>
		<dc:creator>mike w.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jul 2008 19:11:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.delawareliberal.net/?p=5361#comment-42629</guid>
		<description>&quot;If I AM suicidal, then having ANY tool handy with which to kill myself would increase my risk of suicide.

wronggggggggg&quot;

DTB cannot explain why I&#039;m wrong because I&#039;m not.  Correlation does not equal causation.  DTB doesn&#039;t get this simple concept, which is why he also fails to accept my gun vs. spoon analogy.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,382306,00.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;If I AM suicidal, then having ANY tool handy with which to kill myself would increase my risk of suicide.</p>
<p>wronggggggggg&#8221;</p>
<p>DTB cannot explain why I&#8217;m wrong because I&#8217;m not.  Correlation does not equal causation.  DTB doesn&#8217;t get this simple concept, which is why he also fails to accept my gun vs. spoon analogy.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,382306,00.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,382306,00.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: asm826</title>
		<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/#comment-42186</link>
		<dc:creator>asm826</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jul 2008 23:47:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.delawareliberal.net/?p=5361#comment-42186</guid>
		<description>So why do the Japanese kill themselves at such high rates? Sure ain&#039;t guns. 

And if you don&#039;t think gangs would flourish without firearms, look at Britain.

But, hey, I&#039;m not asking you to be a citizen, I&#039;m just telling you that I have the right and I will not be denied the free exercise of that right.

When the window breaks at 3:30 Am, or a group of men get out of a car while your changing a flat on a dark highway, call 911 and wait. I sincerely hope this never happens, and you get to live on in this state of ignorant bliss you&#039;re in. But it&#039;s going to happen to a number of people every day. Remember the Petits, and consider what happened to laws and guns sales in Connecticut as a result.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So why do the Japanese kill themselves at such high rates? Sure ain&#8217;t guns. </p>
<p>And if you don&#8217;t think gangs would flourish without firearms, look at Britain.</p>
<p>But, hey, I&#8217;m not asking you to be a citizen, I&#8217;m just telling you that I have the right and I will not be denied the free exercise of that right.</p>
<p>When the window breaks at 3:30 Am, or a group of men get out of a car while your changing a flat on a dark highway, call 911 and wait. I sincerely hope this never happens, and you get to live on in this state of ignorant bliss you&#8217;re in. But it&#8217;s going to happen to a number of people every day. Remember the Petits, and consider what happened to laws and guns sales in Connecticut as a result.</p>
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		<title>By: Madrocketscientist</title>
		<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/#comment-41523</link>
		<dc:creator>Madrocketscientist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jul 2008 01:40:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.delawareliberal.net/?p=5361#comment-41523</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;If I AM suicidal, then having ANY tool handy with which to kill myself would increase my risk of suicide.

wronggggggggg&lt;/i&gt;

Why is he wrong?  Saying he is wrong does not make it so.  You claim to know so much about how and why people try to commit suicide, yet I see no credentials that grant you such authority.

Now gather round kids, I&#039;m gonna tell you all a story.

When I was 12, I lived out in the country, nearest neighbor was a good half mile away.  As I was riding my bike home from a friends house one day, I noticed a car parked on the shoulder of the road in front of my house, with a young woman in the driver seat.  Being curious, I rode past my driveway and pulled up to the car to see if the lady needed some help.  When I looked inside, I found a young woman with tears in her eyes and a nickel plated revolver braced against the steering wheel, with her thumb on the trigger, and the gun pointed at her.

I asked her if she needed help, and she very politely said no.  I then rode back to my house, went inside, called 911 and informed them of the situation, then took the dogs outside and kept an eye on her car.  The sheriff was there in minutes, and the young woman, as soon as she saw the squad car, pulled the trigger once.

Two months later, she came back and thanked me for saving her life.  I never did learn her name.

My point here is this.  She did not really want to die (she told me so).  She was very upset and it was a cry for help.  Despite the tool used, the manner in which she used it offered her a chance at survival (she put a hole in her lung).  Even if you eat a bullet, you might survive.  Yes, a gun can be instantly fatal, but not always.  

Maybe we should look at suicide survival rates by various means along with success rates by various means in order to get a better understanding.  We should also look at factors such as socio-economic standing, cultural norms, and access to mental health services.  The tool is but one factor, and a minor one at that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>If I AM suicidal, then having ANY tool handy with which to kill myself would increase my risk of suicide.</p>
<p>wronggggggggg</i></p>
<p>Why is he wrong?  Saying he is wrong does not make it so.  You claim to know so much about how and why people try to commit suicide, yet I see no credentials that grant you such authority.</p>
<p>Now gather round kids, I&#8217;m gonna tell you all a story.</p>
<p>When I was 12, I lived out in the country, nearest neighbor was a good half mile away.  As I was riding my bike home from a friends house one day, I noticed a car parked on the shoulder of the road in front of my house, with a young woman in the driver seat.  Being curious, I rode past my driveway and pulled up to the car to see if the lady needed some help.  When I looked inside, I found a young woman with tears in her eyes and a nickel plated revolver braced against the steering wheel, with her thumb on the trigger, and the gun pointed at her.</p>
<p>I asked her if she needed help, and she very politely said no.  I then rode back to my house, went inside, called 911 and informed them of the situation, then took the dogs outside and kept an eye on her car.  The sheriff was there in minutes, and the young woman, as soon as she saw the squad car, pulled the trigger once.</p>
<p>Two months later, she came back and thanked me for saving her life.  I never did learn her name.</p>
<p>My point here is this.  She did not really want to die (she told me so).  She was very upset and it was a cry for help.  Despite the tool used, the manner in which she used it offered her a chance at survival (she put a hole in her lung).  Even if you eat a bullet, you might survive.  Yes, a gun can be instantly fatal, but not always.  </p>
<p>Maybe we should look at suicide survival rates by various means along with success rates by various means in order to get a better understanding.  We should also look at factors such as socio-economic standing, cultural norms, and access to mental health services.  The tool is but one factor, and a minor one at that.</p>
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		<title>By: mike w.</title>
		<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/#comment-41382</link>
		<dc:creator>mike w.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Jul 2008 19:01:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.delawareliberal.net/?p=5361#comment-41382</guid>
		<description>&quot;translated to mean….I don’t give a shite about all those cowardly veterans that took their own lives after serving our country….&quot;

That might be what YOU think it means, given your prior inconsiderate (to be kind) comments about our troops.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;translated to mean….I don’t give a shite about all those cowardly veterans that took their own lives after serving our country….&#8221;</p>
<p>That might be what YOU think it means, given your prior inconsiderate (to be kind) comments about our troops.</p>
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		<title>By: mike w.</title>
		<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/#comment-41037</link>
		<dc:creator>mike w.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Jul 2008 02:45:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.delawareliberal.net/?p=5361#comment-41037</guid>
		<description>^  Unfortunately none of that will matter to them.  They would rather bask in their willful ignorance and scream &quot;Evil assault weapons are dangerous, no one needs one&quot; than gain any knowledge whatsoever on the subject.

The facts don&#039;t support their preconceived views, so they must be ignored.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>^  Unfortunately none of that will matter to them.  They would rather bask in their willful ignorance and scream &#8220;Evil assault weapons are dangerous, no one needs one&#8221; than gain any knowledge whatsoever on the subject.</p>
<p>The facts don&#8217;t support their preconceived views, so they must be ignored.</p>
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		<title>By: Sailorcurt</title>
		<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/#comment-40798</link>
		<dc:creator>Sailorcurt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 18:44:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.delawareliberal.net/?p=5361#comment-40798</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;I guess all the 2nd amendment rights supporters see no reason to prohibit assault weapons.&lt;/i&gt;

On that you&#039;re absolutely correct.  I see no reason to prohibit the class of firearms that you misleadingly term &quot;assault weapons.&quot;  

Rifles in general and those misleadingly referred to as &quot;assault weapons&quot; are used in such a low number of crimes as to be statistically insignificant (less than 1%).  Even if you could successfully eliminate them, the impact on crime would be so small as to be unmeasurable, and assumes that perpetrators of those rare crimes in which they are used wouldn&#039;t simply adopt a different weapon.

The medium powered semi-automatic rifles misleadingly referred to as &quot;assault weapons&quot; are no more deadly (and in some cases are much less so) than any other semi-automatic firearms.

And this does not even address the well documented tendency of the anti-freedom forces to continually add new firearms to those they claim are &quot;assault weapons&quot; to the point where New Jersey&#039;s &quot;assault weapons ban&quot; bans common plinking rifles such as the Marlin Model 60.  

Why should anyone &quot;want&quot; one of these rifles?  Because they are relatively low powered and, hence, have low recoil and are easier to shoot than other loadings.  They tend to be relatively accurate as compared to other low recoil firearms, are rugged, dependable, and easy to maintain, because of their relatively small cases and low powder loadings, are less expensive to reload than more powerful hunting rifles, are generally shorter, lighter and easier to handle...especially for smaller people...shall I go on?

You may not value any of the above characteristics, but, then again, you&#039;re not a shooter so I wouldn&#039;t expect you to.  

As a shooter, weighing the advantages of carbine style semi-automatic rifles against your meretricious contention that they are somehow more suited for &quot;assault&quot; than any other type of rifle (or handgun for that matter) and their use in .7% of crimes;   no, what you misleadingly and falsely call &quot;assault weapons&quot; shouldn&#039;t be singled out for prohibition.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>I guess all the 2nd amendment rights supporters see no reason to prohibit assault weapons.</i></p>
<p>On that you&#8217;re absolutely correct.  I see no reason to prohibit the class of firearms that you misleadingly term &#8220;assault weapons.&#8221;  </p>
<p>Rifles in general and those misleadingly referred to as &#8220;assault weapons&#8221; are used in such a low number of crimes as to be statistically insignificant (less than 1%).  Even if you could successfully eliminate them, the impact on crime would be so small as to be unmeasurable, and assumes that perpetrators of those rare crimes in which they are used wouldn&#8217;t simply adopt a different weapon.</p>
<p>The medium powered semi-automatic rifles misleadingly referred to as &#8220;assault weapons&#8221; are no more deadly (and in some cases are much less so) than any other semi-automatic firearms.</p>
<p>And this does not even address the well documented tendency of the anti-freedom forces to continually add new firearms to those they claim are &#8220;assault weapons&#8221; to the point where New Jersey&#8217;s &#8220;assault weapons ban&#8221; bans common plinking rifles such as the Marlin Model 60.  </p>
<p>Why should anyone &#8220;want&#8221; one of these rifles?  Because they are relatively low powered and, hence, have low recoil and are easier to shoot than other loadings.  They tend to be relatively accurate as compared to other low recoil firearms, are rugged, dependable, and easy to maintain, because of their relatively small cases and low powder loadings, are less expensive to reload than more powerful hunting rifles, are generally shorter, lighter and easier to handle&#8230;especially for smaller people&#8230;shall I go on?</p>
<p>You may not value any of the above characteristics, but, then again, you&#8217;re not a shooter so I wouldn&#8217;t expect you to.  </p>
<p>As a shooter, weighing the advantages of carbine style semi-automatic rifles against your meretricious contention that they are somehow more suited for &#8220;assault&#8221; than any other type of rifle (or handgun for that matter) and their use in .7% of crimes;   no, what you misleadingly and falsely call &#8220;assault weapons&#8221; shouldn&#8217;t be singled out for prohibition.</p>
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		<title>By: mike w.</title>
		<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/#comment-40796</link>
		<dc:creator>mike w.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 18:37:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.delawareliberal.net/?p=5361#comment-40796</guid>
		<description>I love how they hardly even try to refute my points with anything besides hysteria and personal attacks.  Alot of the time they just ignore salient points entirely.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love how they hardly even try to refute my points with anything besides hysteria and personal attacks.  Alot of the time they just ignore salient points entirely.</p>
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		<title>By: Sailorcurt</title>
		<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/#comment-40766</link>
		<dc:creator>Sailorcurt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 17:31:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.delawareliberal.net/?p=5361#comment-40766</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;See what I saidabout gun advocates being fanatic. Forget about Muslim fanatics. Gun advocates have them beat by far. They go crazy when anyone doesn’t agree with them that everyone in the country should have a gun.&lt;/i&gt;

Projection...all the cool kids are doing it.

Translation:  &quot;Anyone who takes the time to rebut a statement on a blog comment thread MUST be a fanatic...oh...wait...Anyway...they disagree with ME so they&#039;ve gotta be crazy right?  RIGHT?   Besides, I can&#039;t actually dispute any of their points so all I can do is call them names.&quot;

By the way, June:  I&#039;d be happy to take assault weapons off the streets.  Point me to them, I&#039;ll give them a good home safely locked up in my gun cabinet.

I&#039;ll even be sure they get plenty of time to work out their latent aggression issues through regular sessions at the range therapeutically punching holes in paper.

(guns on the streets, hmph...and WE&#039;RE the crazy ones...)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>See what I saidabout gun advocates being fanatic. Forget about Muslim fanatics. Gun advocates have them beat by far. They go crazy when anyone doesn’t agree with them that everyone in the country should have a gun.</i></p>
<p>Projection&#8230;all the cool kids are doing it.</p>
<p>Translation:  &#8220;Anyone who takes the time to rebut a statement on a blog comment thread MUST be a fanatic&#8230;oh&#8230;wait&#8230;Anyway&#8230;they disagree with ME so they&#8217;ve gotta be crazy right?  RIGHT?   Besides, I can&#8217;t actually dispute any of their points so all I can do is call them names.&#8221;</p>
<p>By the way, June:  I&#8217;d be happy to take assault weapons off the streets.  Point me to them, I&#8217;ll give them a good home safely locked up in my gun cabinet.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ll even be sure they get plenty of time to work out their latent aggression issues through regular sessions at the range therapeutically punching holes in paper.</p>
<p>(guns on the streets, hmph&#8230;and WE&#8217;RE the crazy ones&#8230;)</p>
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		<title>By: mike w.</title>
		<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/#comment-40759</link>
		<dc:creator>mike w.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 16:58:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.delawareliberal.net/?p=5361#comment-40759</guid>
		<description>&quot;give them some guns and I bet those rates go through the roof!&quot;

And that&#039;s just a guess on your part.  Besides, what does it matter.  Preventing suicide should not be a matter into which government interjects itself, particularly when it&#039;s actions will only act to restrict those who are not suicidal.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;give them some guns and I bet those rates go through the roof!&#8221;</p>
<p>And that&#8217;s just a guess on your part.  Besides, what does it matter.  Preventing suicide should not be a matter into which government interjects itself, particularly when it&#8217;s actions will only act to restrict those who are not suicidal.</p>
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		<title>By: mike w.</title>
		<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/#comment-40758</link>
		<dc:creator>mike w.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 16:55:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.delawareliberal.net/?p=5361#comment-40758</guid>
		<description>Actually no.  As I&#039;ve said before I think people have a right to end their own life.

I may not morally agree with the decision to commit suicide but I&#039;ll respect a persons right to do as they wish with their own life (including ending it)  You on the other hand will call someone a &quot;pussy&quot; when they do the same, despite having no idea what they went through.

Also, my manly comment was in response to Pandora&#039;s childish comment. It&#039;s no more or less manly depending upon the tool used.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually no.  As I&#8217;ve said before I think people have a right to end their own life.</p>
<p>I may not morally agree with the decision to commit suicide but I&#8217;ll respect a persons right to do as they wish with their own life (including ending it)  You on the other hand will call someone a &#8220;pussy&#8221; when they do the same, despite having no idea what they went through.</p>
<p>Also, my manly comment was in response to Pandora&#8217;s childish comment. It&#8217;s no more or less manly depending upon the tool used.</p>
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		<title>By: Delaware's Toughest Blogger</title>
		<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/#comment-40752</link>
		<dc:creator>Delaware's Toughest Blogger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 16:37:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.delawareliberal.net/?p=5361#comment-40752</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;And somehow I don’t think of suicide as a “manly” act.&lt;/i&gt;

translated to mean....I don&#039;t give a shite about all those cowardly veterans that took their own lives after serving our country....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>And somehow I don’t think of suicide as a “manly” act.</i></p>
<p>translated to mean&#8230;.I don&#8217;t give a shite about all those cowardly veterans that took their own lives after serving our country&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Delaware's Toughest Blogger</title>
		<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/#comment-40751</link>
		<dc:creator>Delaware's Toughest Blogger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 16:35:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.delawareliberal.net/?p=5361#comment-40751</guid>
		<description>give them some guns and I bet those rates go through the roof!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>give them some guns and I bet those rates go through the roof!</p>
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		<title>By: Delaware's Toughest Blogger</title>
		<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/#comment-40749</link>
		<dc:creator>Delaware's Toughest Blogger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 16:34:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.delawareliberal.net/?p=5361#comment-40749</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;If I AM suicidal, then having ANY tool handy with which to kill myself would increase my risk of suicide.&lt;/i&gt;

wronggggggggg</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>If I AM suicidal, then having ANY tool handy with which to kill myself would increase my risk of suicide.</i></p>
<p>wronggggggggg</p>
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		<title>By: mike w.</title>
		<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/#comment-40747</link>
		<dc:creator>mike w.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 16:15:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.delawareliberal.net/?p=5361#comment-40747</guid>
		<description>Right. And you&#039;re still missing the point of the Japanese example.   They&#039;re killing themselves at much higher rates than Americans WITHOUT the presence of guns.  That disproves the argument you guys are claiming is &quot;proven&quot; by this study.

And somehow I don&#039;t think of suicide as a &quot;manly&quot; act.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Right. And you&#8217;re still missing the point of the Japanese example.   They&#8217;re killing themselves at much higher rates than Americans WITHOUT the presence of guns.  That disproves the argument you guys are claiming is &#8220;proven&#8221; by this study.</p>
<p>And somehow I don&#8217;t think of suicide as a &#8220;manly&#8221; act.</p>
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		<title>By: pandora</title>
		<link>http://www.delawareliberal.net/2008/07/11/serious-question-3/#comment-40745</link>
		<dc:creator>pandora</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:50:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.delawareliberal.net/?p=5361#comment-40745</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s right they do it the &quot;manly&quot; way!  Guns are for sissies!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s right they do it the &#8220;manly&#8221; way!  Guns are for sissies!</p>
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